Deer Killing vs Deer Hunting

[Mikie]

If its brown its downIIIIIIIII There is a difference in deer killing and deer hunting. There are way too many 4 and 5 month old deer being shot and people think just because there is a either sex day they have to shoot something. I've hunted most of my life and every year where there are people in public hunting areas,managed hunts, or on a lease it seeems the thing to do in alot of cases is to see who can kill the most. I don't know about you but I am seeing less and less deer every year. I stay in the woods too. I often go in with a flashlight and come out at dark with one. I have only seen 10 deer all year,and only 1 buck. I have talked to other people who also aren't seeing any deer. These button bucks and these 4 to 5 month old doe's don't even have their natural instinct to survive skills developed yet. I know people who shoot these deer and are proud of it,Alot of these button bucks have just been weaned and their mother has run them off because the rut is starting and she don't want the mature bucks to hurt it. Its ok if you are a juvinell and maybe you get excited and you shoot one. The thing is that 10 point buck might just be a few yards behind thoes doe's.Thats how he go to be big. All I am saying is there are alot of places getting over hunted. One doe can be responsible for as many as 75 deer over a 10 year period. If you are seeing plenty of deer then its ok to shoot a few doe's, but if you keep over killing them year after year then you don't have anything to reproduce then the results is no deer. I like to see deer when I go Hunting its not exciting if you don't.
Teach these new or young hunters the sport of deer hunting not deer killing!!!!!!!!!! Whats your view ?

 

[josh.schreiber]

right on

 

[ukfod1]

right on

 

[Eyeman2]

I've noticed a lot of hunters that lease and private land owners are starting to plant "food plots" for deer.
That may one reason you are not seeing the deer you saw 2 years ago.
Deer follow the food. Granted, they do stay in the general area they were born in, unless dogs, fire, or over hunting moves them to a mopre desireable place.
TWRA does a good job of deer management, but they can only do so much. When a doe population is undisturbed for several years, you get a lot of inbreeding,( sorta like the Democratic Party)...just had to throw that in...and you get smaller deer, bucks & does, not counting disease.
I'm a meat hunter/fisherman. If I get a trophy, that's just a bonus, and every so often I get that monster.
In my area the deer population is TOO large , does only.
Some farmers have permission to kill all they want to, thanks to <<off the record>> TWRA.
The deer are a nuscience and nobody in the "hood" can grow a decent garden.
Plant a food plot for your deer hunting. It takes work, but that's what makes it more enjoyable.
It's like putting out brush piles for fish. Ain't easy, but you can pull up on that marked spot and catch supper.

P S: I like veggies with my meat.

 

[REELWORLD42]

I think if your just hunting to put a head on the wall your hunting for the wrong reason, I was brought up not to kill it if your not going to eat it.

 

[churly]

I agree. Nothing makes me sicker than seeing a grown man gloating over a 6 month old deer he "outsmarted". They need a law to make it illeagal to kill such deer. I could get on a soapbox right now but I think Mikie did a good enough job...

 

[buzz]

WHOA...Mikie...I was just yanking Churleys chain. I used to belong to a hunting club in Giles County. It was nothing for the members to kill 30 deer a year. There were a couple of guys that got into those Pissing contest about the killing...not the hunting. I know one guy that shot two VERY young deer that were with their mother, then shot the mother. WHY?????? I ask him....why did you kill the young ones...they couldn't weigh 40 lbs apiece. Then he came in with a pretty RED FOX. Why? I would like to set in my treesatand and just watched the fox. When I started taking my son...he of coarse got the fever to shoot the first thing he saw. I let him kill a couple of does...then I told him. The next one you shoot....your on your own...dragging...gutting...getting it to the processor. He finally killed a decent 8 pointer...then it was like.....why did I shoot those does...when these big boys are here. I got out of that club...just couldn't take "if it's brown it's down" attitude anymore. I took Churley over there once. He will tell you, it was an ideal set up.

 

[SpurHunter]

I too can get on a soap box, but for the other side. I hunt for meat, and to be outdoors, especially with my kids. I have no idea where you are hunting, but good grief, the deer population is HUGE in TN right now! I have seen more deer the last few years than ever before. I used to worry about spending time in the woods and not killing one. Now I wonder how many I will kill each time I go.

I have no desire to outsmart any animal, I enjoy hunting, period. I love a huge rack, (no snickering), but dont give two turds if I ever kill a deer with one.

The same "shame" can be levied at a person fishing the jumps for bass, what is so hard about catching those fish? Nothing, but its damn fun! Fish the deepest place in the lake, I bet you will find more big bass there right? And that is harder than fishing the "easy" spots.

I for one trust TWRA, and the biologists more than the author of this thread. I dont know him from Adam, but untill he proves to me he knows more about deer management than TWRA, I will keep on killing all the deer they say, (and BEG I might add) I can kill. Bucks, does, buttons, you name it.

Hunting is not about the kill for me, its about family-time, fellowship with friends, an putting my favorite meat in the freezer or on the grill.

 

[buzz]

This arguement could go on forever. Too many deer...I agree. Have you counted up the amount of "legal" deer you can kill in Unit "L". Somewhere in the neighborhood of what...140? Personally..I don't like deer meat. The tenderloin...yep. But when I squeeze the trigger...I know where that deer is going. I have a black friend, disabled VN veteran, that is waiting by the phone to come and get his deer.

 

[Hook1]

If you guys are seeing so many deer just come down to NW Georgia. After one season you'll appreciate the (or any) deer you kill. Most times I see one its by itself and that makes it hard to size up some times. A few years back I shot 4 and got really selective about the deer I shot after that. I ended up not shooting anything else all season. However; even if I haven't seen or killed anything I know the difference between a 1.5 year old and a yearling. I won't shoot a yearling deer it has to be enough meat to at least make the $60 dollar processing fee worth while.

 

[wrechin2]

Always 2 sides........... Some hunt for the heads and other for the meat.

You asked for "our" views and here is mine, sorry long.................

I didn't get to hunt alot of good placed growing up, then I was in the military and didn't get to hunt. Now I simply don't have time.... SO, I don't have that many deer under my belt like most people my age do. Once you get to a stage where you have killed say 100+ deer in your lifetime, then most people start "Re-Thinking" their own ways of hunting. So in your lifetime, out of your many,many deer, did you EVER kill a young or small deer??? If it was brown was it down?????Did you ever shoot the first deer you seen, or did you always wait enen from the begining???????Be honest..............

Could it be your are at a graduated stage in your hunting career where you now look down upon people who aren't regually killing wall hangers????? That man gloating over the 6 moth old deer, what if it was his first one???? Yes, they are adults who have never hunted. That would be like me just starting out in racing and telling Mark Martin I once went 140MPH in a race. Do you think he would be impressed?????? No, he wouldn't. So it seems, you guys with the 6 or 7 heads hangin on the wall aren't impressed by someone not killing a wall hanger.

Many people I knew growing up hunting, had the same attitude. They killed what they saw that was legal by the regulations put out by TWRA. We were young kids and didn't care about a trophy. We wanted deer meat. Then today, the same hunters, many years later and many deer later, they are a lot more patient in choosing the deer they harvest. They are looking for the wall hangers. They are at a graduated stage in their hunting career. Truth be known, They probably think the same thing about killing small deer now as many of you do. Yet, they used to do it..........

I honestly like to kill the young deer. I was out for the deer meat. Is it wrong to like veil also????

Killing a young deer is MY right. It is YOUR opinion that it is wrong according to YOUR "Pratices". Then to want TWRA make a law based on your opinings........

Just like the clubs who say kill only a 8 point or better and it need to be a certain score before you can harvest it. That is their "Pratices" and not regulations of TWRA. They are trying to raise trophys not food. Is that still considered hunting??? 75 years ago, what do you think the opinions were when someone killed a young deer???? If they didn't kill it, they didn't eat. I bet the thoughts of envy especially if they didn't have anything to show. It was considered hunting then. Why is it so different today???? Because we can go to the grocery store and buy meat???

Everyone has their own thought and practices on hunting and fishing.

This is ONLY a EXAMPLE........but..........That would be like me saying all the people who bass fish need to use a 20" plastic worm so it lessen your chance of catching a 1LB bass as some fish die after being handled. Then that will effect the future generation of the fish. That would just be a OPINION. How many differnt views do you think would be on that thread????


emoToast emoToast emoToast emoToast emoToast

 

[SpurHunter]

PAY to have a deer cut? NO way, I do all my own.

Got another question for some of you. When you buy meat, chicken, pork, beef, etc, you want the best, most tender, moist, meats right? Those would be the youngest animals they offer, not talking veal here, just good meats. So since I hunt....for meat......I am shopping with my rifle, bow, etc, for the best of the best. That means, young, tender does, and yearlings, fawns, you name it. Who wants to eat an ol buck? Yuck!

 

[SpurHunter]

Seems we were composing at the same time and with similar views! emoThumbsup

 

[wrechin2]

SpurHunter - 1/12/2010 12:13 PM PAY to have a deer cut? NO way, I do all my own. Got another question for some of you. When you buy meat, chicken, pork, beef, etc, you want the best, most tender, moist, meats right? Those would be the youngest animals they offer, not talking veal here, just good meats. So since I hunt....for meat......I am shopping with my rifle, bow, etc, for the best of the best. That means, young, tender does, and yearlings, fawns, you name it. Who wants to eat an ol buck? Yuck!

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I agree!! The young meat is so tender. I guess it boils dow to your definition of hunting. Meat or trophy.</p>

 

[Kirk]

Deer react to hunting pressure. When you start killing does they don't leave they just go nocturnal. I run off-season camera census in 3 counties and I can assure you the deer are still plentiful. Actually they are more plentiful than they were 2 years ago. They just don't walk through the woods during daylight like they use to. Hunt the edges of thick cover at daylight and just before dark and you will see deer. Hunt open woods and you won't see much during daylight.

What a lot of people are mistaking as reduced deer population is actually a switch to a nocturnal pattern. I will start my winter camera census the first of February. I will post some pictures I get at night with my IR camera. In past years I have got pictures of deer that have 15 and 20 in a group. They "yard" up in the late winter and is easy to get February and March photos of very large groups of deer.

 

[churly]

I'll vouch for Buzz, those boys had a bad azz piece of ground that had crazy potential, but A mature buck was far and few between simply because they shot whatever.

I think the tide is turning on deer managment. My grandfather was raised hunting the same place I hunt today. I know he has done 5 backflips in his grave over the nice bucks we take outta there. When he was a boy they didn't hunt deer because there were none there. Only foxes and rabbits. Once deer were restocked (after WWII) they were able to shoot one buck a year, and they shot the first antlered deer that came by. Today is a different story and a todays deer hunters are trending toward trophy managment. The only reason we kill big deer on our farm now is because we only shoot bucks 2.5 years plus and lots of does. I'm no bilogist, but I have a clue what and why. It is obvious that hunters nationwide are adopting these practices as our age structures and buck to doe ratios have moved in a positive direction...Back off my box...

If any of you guys have not yet been there check out www.tndeer.com there is a lot of advice and info as well as pics of deer from all over the state. Its hard to find a TN county that doesn't have a pic of a monster on the trophy room. My point is no matter where you live, If you let them go they will grow.

 

[SpurHunter]

"My point is no matter where you live, If you let them go they will grow." I will MOSTLY agree with you, but I know you know all too well since you huint in IL and other places, soil content has more to do with big bucks than just letting all small bucks walk. There is ZERO doubt the quality of bucks in TN is starting raise eyebrows for sure.

 

[Jmax]

I feel in some areas there are too many deer in TN. Look at how many car wrecks we have now that hit deer vrs say 10 years ago. The population is up. I hope that the G&F of TN know what they are doing on the control kills for does and some control areas. This year we had some increased doe kills to decrease the numbers. In some areas when hunting pressure gets heavy there is an out of balance that cannot be helped. They control it county wide, an area where there are a lot of hunters with that one part of the county could indeed get too much pressure. I have always tried to kill a legal buck, may be a doe and then go horn hunting for a mature buck. Keeps the freezer full and has worked for me in my club over the last 31 years. emoAngel Jmax

 

[wrechin2]

I do not disagree if you let them go they will grow. But not everyone is going hunting for trophys or trying to grow them.........

 

[3391]

Part of managing a deer herd is managing people. For years there was an unspoken rule " don't shoot does". That led to wildly skewed sex ratio's (often 10:1 or better does to bucks) and primarily small bucks that were cropped heavily every year. As herds have grown the "no doe shooting" rule has led to overpopulation that again leads to smaller bucks due to limited food sources. A combination of increased doe harvest and limited buck harvest has led to some of the best bucks ever being harvested here in Hamilton County. Fawn predation, lack of stable food sources, poor soil quality, wildlife disease such as EHD or pink eye can all limit populations in individual areas or even counties. Those areas that do have a population that is at or near it's carrying capacity can withstand increased antlerless harvest. Don't be to quick to talk down to those who shoot younger deer or does. By controlling the herd with increased anterless harvest it insures the health of the herd. The harvest of a button buck should count against your statewide buck harvest. But, with internet check in this would be an unenforceable rule. There are more deer in Southeast Tennessee than there has ever been in the modern era so this harvest can't be doing that much harm. This might not be the case everywhere but it is here in Hamilton County.