New Record Spot - KY vs Ala?

[MadBomber]

I was curious about the genetic strain of the new Record Spot. It has always been my belief that a pure "Kentucky" spot will not get bigger than 3-4 lbs. And, we all know that "Alabama" spots get up to 10 lbs or so. I posed the question to Mike Jolley as to the possibility of the new record being an Alabama spot. I mentioned the illegal introduction of "Alabama" spots to Chatuge lake as an example His reply:</p>

________________________________________________________________</p>

<font size="1">"The particular strain (Kentucky vs. Alabama) of spotted bass that inhabits
Parksville Reservoir is not known....yet. It will be determined by further DNA
analysis. I suspect, personally, that it is an Alabama spotted bass. Which ever
it is, it is a pure strain, we do know that much.Spotted bass were definitely
introduced, illegally, at some point by individuals. In the early 1990's spotted
bass were unheard of in our electrofishing surveys at Parksville."</font> </p>

____________________________________________________________________</p>

Of course, what this means to all of us, is the high probability of record size spots out there for the hunting. My congratulations to Jack Watson, the new record holder. I'll bet Craaazy is about to pee all over himself!!! emoBigsmile
</p>

 

[jim4596]

I told you guys several yrs ago when you were holding your spot tournaments and eating them all that they can get big and they have been caught big around here. I have caught some big spots, on chick, nick, neely henry, logan martin, etc. You plainly said that the ones on chick and nick never get over 2 or 3 pounds.
I think this fish and the record proves that spots do grow big around here, not just on the coosa river.
Thats why I hated to see you guys holding those tournaments.

If i remember right, didnt andy morgan catch one about 6 lbs on chick, but he released it so it never go dna tested.

 

[Bprice]

Jim, lets not start this arguement again please. Nothing any of those tournaments did where illegal.

 

[jim4596]

im not arguing... im stating facts.

 

[SpurHunter]

Those TX were held in accordance with the regs on the books, and those regs are designed to INCREASE the large mouth and small mouth bass. Why catch lots of 2lb spots when if you remove lots of them, you can catch more 8lb LM and 5lb SM? Makes perfect sense to me.

I for one will be 100% behind all spot TX in the future, the regs were changed based on sound science.

 

[flip1up]

MB, your right, its kinda neat that the record came from close by. Makes me want to fish up there again. Its been about 2 years since I visited there. There is some good Lg. Mouth fishing in that lake in the early spring IMO. Especially after a decent rain when you get some stain. I caught several good ones flipping a big DJW jig in the treetops.

Congrats to Mr. Watson!!

 

[drumking]

I love spots better than crappie. I'm eating them. I'm also abiding by the creel limits too. MadBomber is my hero. Fat Albert too, even though his limit is one. emoPoke emoBigsmile emoUpsmile emoGeezer

 

[flip1up]

I think that both MBs successful efforts below Chick. Dam and Jims comments have merit. I think that in the right enviornment such as Parksville, there is the ( now proven ) possibility of Spotted Bass growing to world class size, or atleast State record size. But I think that below the Chick. Dam that possibility is small and they have a detremental effect on the other Black Bass. The two fisheries are very diverse when compared.

 

[elwestb]

I wish the spot limits where the same as the largemouth. Let them grow up and we'll see! Look at Carter's, Lainer, Lewis Smith, Martin, Neely Henery and Wedowee, they all are 90% spots, and good ones too! For years the world record spot bounced back and forth between Lanier and Smith until California captured the title. As for N'Jack, I've got a friend of mine who swears that for years he and his son have caught both s/m and spots in the 4-5 lb. class regularly above Raccoon Mtn. in 30 - 40 ft. of water on tubes with 4-6lb. line. He said he knows they probably released a new Tenn. spot record several times!? I just don't understand why the little spot is persecuted? Let 'em grow!

 

[xrfoxracer]

i see nothing wrong with the limits at all.... but i have personally caught a 4lb spot and a 3.5 lb spot on the chick last yearin the same fishing hole... they do get big maybe not 8 pounders or anything but they are no doubt fun to catch....

madbommer.... did they not confirm that the new record was a kentucky spot by DNA from what i understood it was but im not 100 percent positive

 

[craazyboutbass]

Yep... its killing me. State record coming out of Parksville has been exciting...

Spotted bass do grow big around here, but they can be tricky to catch.

 

[tie1on]

Ive fish below chick dam, and in the past few yrs, in late spring to early summer, ive caught several spots in the 3-4lb range. Theyre so fat on threadfins, ive had them spit out 3 or 4 shad at a time, before i can through them back in the water.

 

[flip1up]

Remember that the creels were only changed BELOW Chick. Dam, and only so far down river.</p>

Most of the Spots that are being harvested are the 10-12" fish, thats what I hear anyway. </p>

 

[MadBomber]

elwestb - 1/28/2009 6:49 PM I wish the spot limits where the same as the largemouth. Let them grow up and we'll see! Look at Carter's, Lainer, Lewis Smith, Martin, Neely Henery and Wedowee, they all are 90% spots, and good ones too! For years the world record spot bounced back and forth between Lanier and Smith until California captured the title. As for N'Jack, I've got a friend of mine who swears that for years he and his son have caught both s/m and spots in the 4-5 lb. class regularly above Raccoon Mtn. in 30 - 40 ft. of water on tubes with 4-6lb. line. He said he knows they probably released a new Tenn. spot record several times!? I just don't understand why the little spot is persecuted? Let 'em grow!

</p>

We have a lot of new people on here who were not here 2 years ago when we got the limit changed. For those folks, let me restate the issues. The Tennessee River spotted bass is a different subspecies than the spotted bass in Georgia and Alabama. The stretch of river below Chickamauga Dam is overpopulated with spots. Where spots and smallmouth share the same water, the spots tend to crowd out smallmouth. Hybridization between largemouth & Spots is taking place in the Tennessee River. Berry(BigFishGuide)'s potential record was disallowed because the fish was a cross. My contention is that any spot larger than 4 lbs in the Tennessee River is a LM/spot hybrid.</p>

Overpopulation of spots is such a problem in East Tennessee that all the Region 4 lakes (Cherokee, Douglas, Fontana, etc.) have a 15/day limit, except Norris. There is <u>no</u> limit on the number of spots you can take from Norris. Please don't get yourselves too awfully wound up about the poor little spots below Chickamauga Dam. The 15/day limit only extends down to the mouth of South Chickamauga Creek, about 2 miles.</p>

Chatugeused to be knownas a smallmouth lake. Some folks illegally stocked Al/GA spots in Chatuge. As I understand it, smallmouth have virtually disappeared from Chatuge.</p>

If you read my post carefully, you will note that the TWRA is doing further testing to determine if Mr. Watson's fish is an Alabama spot. That is not to take anything away from his record because the fish is a pure strain Spot. Mike Jolley, our Regional Biologist, suspects it is an Alabama version.If so, we now have a lake in Tennessee capable of producing very large spotted bass!!</p>

 

[fish4thepeck]

Mb, don't mean to get off the subject but am curious. Would there be DNA testing regarding a Florida strain LM (Micropterus Salmoides Floridanus) to see if there is a cross with a LM (micropterus Salmides) if a State record was caughtt in one of our Tennessee lakes?

 

[Guest]

fish4thepeck - 1/29/2009 2:55 AM

Mb, don't mean to get off the subject but am curious. Would there be DNA testing regarding a Florida strain LM (Micropterus Salmoides Floridanus) to see if there is a cross with a LM (micropterus Salmides) if a State record was caughtt in one of our Tennessee lakes?

I belive the difference is strain vs subsepecies.

 

[Guest]

elwestb - 1/28/2009 8:49 PM

....I just don't understand why the little spot is persecuted? Let 'em grow!

In lots of areas they are introduced (ie NOT native). In areas that they have been introducted the native fishes (smallmouth and largemouth) populations suffer.

 

[MadBomber]

fish4thepeck - 1/29/2009 12:55 AM Mb, don't mean to get off the subject but am curious. Would there be DNA testing regarding a Florida strain LM (Micropterus Salmoides Floridanus) to see if there is a cross with a LM (micropterus Salmides) if a State record was caught in one of our Tennessee lakes?

</p>

I believe R14 is right on in his response. The new record was allowed because the fish was a pure strain spot. Further DNA testing is being done to determine if the fish is a northern or southern subspecies. If a new record Largemouth was reported (current record is 14+ lbs caught in 1954) I'm sure it would be tested just out of curiosity if nothing else. Many of us old-timers remember the effort to stock Florida strain bass into Chickamauga. I personally contributed $50 to that effort. I don't recall anyone ever confirming whether or not that effort was successful. I doubt if any of the original stocking managed to stay together long enough to breed with each other. So, I think that whatever number of those fish lived long enough to reach spawning size have by now had their genes diluted many times over by our native variety. The spot record was 5 lbs, 8oz. caught in Center Hill in 1989 (20 years ago!!!). That particular fish just about has to be a "native" northern variety at it's absolute size limit, in other words a freak of nature, or it was actually a LM/spot hybrid. No DNA testing in 1989.</p>

I believe the Parksville fish will prove out to be an Alabama spot, which opens up the possibility of the record being raised upwards of 10lbs or so. </p>

The Tennessee State record, and World Record,for Smallmouth has stood since 1955. The LM record has stood since 1954. I find it curious that with today's much more efficient methods of bass fishing that these records still stand!! A Smallmouth weighing a little over 10lbs was caught below Chickamauga dam a few years ago and occasionally we hear of a 9 lb'er being caught. Mother Nature has her own ideas about how big Black Bass will get. There are very good reasons why there are laws against illegal stocking, the main one being "It's not nice tofool Mother Nature!"</p>

 

[elwestb]

? Ok, for the sake of argument, hasn't the spots been native to the Tennessee river system, like forever? and I can remember when they wasn't any small mouth to speak of in Chickamauga or below the dam. So, which species rooted out and took over from which? Looks like to me the S/M has fared much better, which I'm very glad. I remember when most of us in the Chattanooga Bass Club back in the 70's and 80's were hauling S/M, regardless of size from Tim's and Watts Bar to dump in Chickamauga at the Wolftever bridge. I remember how excited we all were when fellow club member Steve Kite caught a 3lb S/M at the rip rap there. We knew that at least some had survived! But I just don't understand why the state / TWRA allows such a harvest of spots, limit amounts and size?! Why haven't spots taken over Dale Hollow, Cumberland, Priest, Douglass, Blue Ridge, and others? Carter's was stocked with S/M in the 70's. they died out! I don;t pretend to know why, they just did! Chatuge, Lanier, Lewis Smith, Wedowee and others, I believe just aren't conducive habitat for the S/M! Don';t know why? Just like I don't know why Dale Hollow and Pickwick are! {They have good spots too!}

 

[beetlespin]

They taste good....