Chickamauga Dam Smallmouth & Spots 11-22-2006

[jim4596]

im not getting into it, but go back and look at barry's (big fish guide) posts. he catches plenty of them (4+ lb spots) on nick and north guntersville. i too have caught some of them, so has andrew m.

 

[MadBomber]

The comment by Why, or was it When?, about rather catching a 4 lb spot than a 6 lb largemouth intrigued me.  In following the posts lately, it appears to me that Why and When have a special knack for catching large bass.</p>

Oh, I almost left out BFG.  He seems to consistantly catch large bass.  I understand he uses live bait mostly.</p>

Me personally, I have been fishing these area waters for 45 years.  I have caught several 6+ lb bass, but my personal best spot was caught in Soddy Creek at least 20 years ago and didn't weigh over 3 1/2 lbs.  I have said before that if our spots got to be 4lbs or better and I could catch a few of them, I would never have raised the issue.  I have literally caught hundreds of spots below the dam this year and I don't remember any of them weighing over 2 lbs. Granted, I fish right against the rip rap and that is no doubt where the smaller fish are, but I also put in quite a few hours fishing rip rap that drops off into 25 ft.</p>

Here is the bottom line.  I decided pretty much on my own that there were too many small spots below the dam.  I went to the TWRA Commission with my concerns.  The TWRA were caught with their pants down, so to speak.  They admitted they had no data for the river, only for the lake.  They were not prepared to respond to my concern and request.  Most if not all Region IV lakes already have 15 spot per day limits.  Watts Bar, Chickamauga, Nickajack, Guntersville are in region III. Fort loudon is a mainstream Tennessee River lake, but I think it has a 15 spot per day limit.  I can't find my regs book at the moment, but Snuffy can confirm or deny that.  Fort loudon is in Region IV. </p>

All the Region III Biologist could do is ask the commission for some time to assess the situation.  That has begun.  This is, as far as I know, the first time the TWRA has studied the tailwaters of Chickamauga Dam, even though these waters have been designated as a "Trophy Smallmouth Fishery".  This is the reason for the restrictive limit on smallmouth.</p>

Mike Jolley, Region III Biologist has asked for our help.  It is in our best interest to provide the best data we can so that a <u>correct</u> decision can be made.  It may turn out that we have too many largemouth and spots in proportion to smallmouth.  It may also turn out we don't have a problem.  Lets do all we can to help!!    </p>

 

[MadBomber]

polo-dog - 12/1/2006 5:22 PM MrWiskers, that's a lot of spots. Must have been a rip rap bank. Just pulling your leg MB! emoAngel emoAngel

</p>

Trust me, it was a rip rap bank!!</p>

 

[whywecatchsomany]

Madbomber, I am all for helping with the survey and study in any way possible. I do love to catch nice spots and of course love smallmouth. WHEN and I have no more knack for catching bigger fish than anyone else (lots of better fishermen and women on here than I am) but I think WHERE we fish and when we fish gives us a good chance at a nice one. We do catch a few spots (almost always at a lower rate than smallmouth) but they are usually pretty good ones.

I do totally agree with you though, if you get right on the riprap with small cranks, tubes, etc. you are going to catch a large number of fish and ALOT of spots if the current is not too strong.

I am curious to see how the numbers stack up in the months of Dec - Feb as the water gets cold.

EAT MORE SPOTMOUTHS or is it eat more LARGESPOTS, anything but SMALLMOUTH.emoThumbsup

 

[MrWiskers]

jim4596 - 12/1/2006 9:42 PM

im not getting into it, but go back and look at barry's (big fish guide) posts. he catches plenty of them (4+ lb spots) on nick and north guntersville. i too have caught some of them, so has andrew m.

I am pretty sure Berry catches most of his BELOW Nickjack dam were I said very clearly that larger spots exist in good numbers. Again I am not saying no one has caught spots larger than 3lbs within the Nickajack empoundment, I just have not seen evidence of it. Just one picture is all I ask. If you go through the Hall of Fame you will not find one single 4lb or better spot from Nickajack. If a post exists then Dhaun missed it.

 

[Buoy-Master]

whywecatchsomany - 12/1/2006 10:54 PM ...snip... I am curious to see how the numbers stack up in the months of Dec - Feb as the water gets cold. EAT MORE SPOTMOUTHS or is it eat more LARGESPOTS, anything but SMALLMOUTH.emoThumbsup

</p>

I agree. Even with the change in weather and water temp, there still seems to be a huge abundance of spots, if not more than this summer. A couple of nice smallmouth here and there but still not in the #s they should be. Maybe we should have kept the data going on this especially with the winter months. </p>

 

[flip1up]

I wonder why the Spotted Bass get so much bigger below Nick. Dam? You can catch big Spots for several miles down lake too. I have caught them up to 4 pounds as far as Coon creek. My old T partner told me he caught 1 that was well over 5 pounds off the Hwy. 117 bridge supports one day, he wouldnt tell me wrong either. Anybody know why this may be?

 

[MadBomber]

 EAT MORE SPOTMOUTHS or is it eat more LARGESPOTS, anything but SMALLMOUTH.emoThumbsup[/QUOTE] </p>



Amen on the "anything but smallmouth"</p>

One thing I have noticed as the water cooled off is that I caught bigger spots in the same places I caught small spots earlier.</p>

 

[jim4596]

so we all agree that there are some big spots below nickajack dam. one of the bigger spots i have caught on the tn river system came from the mouth of mud creek on guntersville. i cant remember but it seems like it was close to 5 lbs. but that was several years ago.
anyway, if they get that big down there then they have the potential to get that big on chick and nick. carl said that they were a different strain than the coosa river spots and that they dont get over 3 lbs, but i think barry has posted plenty of pics to disprove that. so if its the same genetic strain of spots that barry is catching then they have the potential to get that big on nick. does that make sense. i went back and reread what i wrote and im not sure it made sense.
im not going to get into a huge debate about it this time, but i do know that i love catching them and i hope u guys dont eat the ones over 12". a big spot is one of the meanest fish alive. a 2 lb spot is fun for me to catch and fights like a 3lb largemouth.

 

[jim4596]

on a side note to this discussion, has anyone seen the spots on lanier. they are huge. i have seen many pics posted of spots over 5 and 6 lbs. i read that they get that big because of the introduction of blueback herring.

 

[Fishheadspin]

OK OK OK>>>>so i almost had to eat CROW. but the one i caught today still was not over 4. and there were several 3 lb spots weighed in. but funny how everyone of us gawk at a 3 lb spot and say how great of a fish it is ....( and it is a good fish) but a 3 lb largemouth weighed in at most tournaments never gets a second look. Because spots do nto get that big on nickajack and chickamauga -----except very rarely.

I think it goes back to the old "a big fish in a small pond" saying....you can have a pond with a lot of little fish or a pond with one big fish.


For any biologist on the forum.... where can i find data on growth rates of spots vs LM and SM?

 

[Carl Guffey]

All I can say is how many pictures of four pound spots do you have and how many 10 inch spots have been caught in the last year. One three plus spot has eaten enough largemouth and smallmouth frye to fill the upper Nickajack basin with quality fish for everyone to catch.

 

[jim4596]

i wasnt trying to make u mad carl,or anyone else for that matter. im just trying to say that our fishery isnt that bad. i think it is doing great. in the cff tourney pics i see that there were several good spots that were caught. i would rather go catch spots than nothing at all. it could be worse by far.

 

[BigFishGuide]

Keep plugging away at those spots theres a 6lbr and a new state record out there to be caught. There's got to be one below Nick to many big ones being caught. Winter time is the best time nice and fat.

 

[Fshnman]

Fishheadspin, the best source where one can find data on growth rates of largemouths, smallmouths and spotted bass is in the book FISHES OF TENNESSEE (ISBN # 0-87049-711-1). The authors, David Etnier and Wayne Starnes do an excellent job in describing growth rates as it relates to age and size. There is too much information for me to provide it in this message; and since I do not have a scanner, the book can be purchased at the TN Aquarium's gift shop or by going online at www.bestwebbuys.com where you can get it cheaper than the gift shop's price. When you get to the home page, hit the "BOOKS" tab and type in the ISBN #. A list will appear of all the companies on the Internet with their prices going from the cheapest to the most expensive. I would be willing to photocopy the pages with the growth information and send them to you if could pass them on to someone in the CFF who has a scanner. It would be nice to share that information with everyone. Since the authors used the metric system, you will need these conversion factors to better understand the lengths and weights: 1.) 1 millimeter (mm) = .0394 inches; 2.) 1 kilogram (kg) = 2.2 lbs; and 3.) 454 grams (gr) = 1 lb.

 

[polo-dog]

Fshnman, that looks like a neat book. I may look for it used but I have found it a couple of places new. I read some reviews and others seemed to like it a lot. I have a bunch of books on fishing, but none of them are really oriented to research. I spoke with a good buddy that was in a fisheries biology program and said that Etnier was one of his professors. I didn't bring it up to him but he just saw the name on the website when I was looking the book up. It's a small world you know?

 

[Fishheadspin]

Great thanks for the info on the book i will try to pick it up.

 

[Carl Guffey]

Jim4596, I am not mad just making a point.
State records:
largemouth: 14 lbs. 8 ozs.
smallmouth: state and world record: 11 lbs. 15 ozs.
spotmouth: 5 lbs. 8 ozs.

Given the right conditions any one fish might out grow it's peers. Spots don't grow and they eat themselves out of house and everyone elses homes.

 

[rsimms]

Is this thread ever going to die????? emoConfused emoBigsmile

 

[MadBomber]

I wonder what the record for views and replies is?