Death Panels

[outcaster]

Cheez, because someone disagrees with your extreme right wing position on abortion does not make them evil and doom them to hell, or even wrong. Just because you believe this with all your heart does not make it so. When I hear you state these extreme views on this single issue as a basis and justification to oppose everything and anyone in politics or Gov't who does share your view, I understand where you are coming from, and take every post with a "grain of salt"

 

[Guest]

outcaster - 9/5/2009 10:36 PM

Cheez, because someone disagrees with your extreme right wing position on abortion does not make them evil and doom them to hell, or even wrong. Just because you believe this with all your heart does not make it so. When I hear you state these extreme views on this single issue as a basis and justification to oppose everything and anyone in politics or Gov't who does share your view, I understand where you are coming from, and take every post with a "grain of salt"

Show me one place where I said anything about anybody going to hell. You cannot do it. Believing that it is evil to murder a human being is not extreme. It is the absolute truth.

My opposition to anyone in politics or government has a baseline. It is abortion. If someone supports abortion then there is little need to discuss anything else. Call me extreme or whatever other adjective you may choose. I simply happen to believe that innocent human life is sacred. Some people do not. May God have mercy on their soul.

Take what I post here or anywhere else any way that you want to. That is your right. Just as it is my right to make the post as long as the good folks that own this forum allow it.

 

[Hagen]

outcaster - 9/4/2009 9:18 PM

Wow! All this because the President wants to make quality healthcare available to all Americans? Now I get all the Hitler references. lol. Doc, I think it's time the President dropped the "bi-partisan" approach (I have). He needs to now use his majority in both houses of Congress to do what we elected him to do! Finally fix healthcare, and have the testicular fortitude to take on the insurance lobby. He will lose my support if he does not follow through. President Obama and Democrats may pay a political price for taking on this issue, but I believe the political price will be much greater if they let a loud minority, spreading lies, half truths, and using scare tactics to win the day.

Medicare has worked out pretty good. Government housing, public schools, public transportation, public defender's all of those programs are prime examples of quality. No thank you! Which senate committee is this legislation comming out off.....? Finance committee so it seems the issue is affordability. You'll wish you had expensive healthcare once you get a dose of "quality" healthcare from the government.

 

[Guest]

Mark we hashed this out over in the off topic forum when the healthcare subject first came up. All the dems here had to offer was the tired old "let's do something even if it is wrong" argument. If you want to see what these guys are all about go read the last post on that thread. It was made at 7:37 pm on 7/26/09.Then ask yourself why it was the last post.

 

[Guest]

Hagen - 9/6/2009 2:40 AM
Medicare has worked out pretty good.

Maybe that is the fundamental difference. I see medicare as broke system (and been broke for along time), which cost more than it pays, is inefficient, and has many loopholes. To keep medicare solvent would require increasing the payment of individuals and the increasing payments by businesses (or reduction/drop in coverage). Basically baby boomers are using all the funds up, while new workers have to foot the ever increasing bills.

 

[finbully]

R14 - 9/6/2009 8:03 AM
Basically baby boomers are using all the funds up, while new workers have to foot the ever increasing bills.

Sounds like the government is in the Ponzi scheme business to me.

 

[outcaster]

cheez - 9/6/2009 7:39 AM

Mark we hashed this out over in the off topic forum when the healthcare subject first came up. All the dems here had to offer was the tired old "let's do something even if it is wrong" argument. If you want to see what these guys are all about go read the last post on that thread. It was made at 7:37 pm on 7/26/09.Then ask yourself why it was the last post.

You raise a good question cheez. This post was not responded to for almost a week. Why do you and most of the others that have commented on this particular thread have not, or will not address the two youtube videos I posted? Instead we have discussed Hitler, Satan, Abortion, Medicare, and Sales Tax collection with regards to fishing guides and tackle sales. emoScratch Seems none of you want respond to, or defend the fact that health insurance companys pay out bonuses to medical reviewers for denial of payment for healthcare. Maybe you think it's okay and nothing needs to be done about it. I hope that your surgery or medical treatment does not end up as someones bonus check. BTW How do you think BCBS paid for that Taj Mahal on Cameron Hill? Could it be from paying as few claims as possible? Or being allowed to "cherry pick" from the healthiest segments of our society? Seems most of you really don't want to have a discussion about Healthcare at all, but instead divert us to Hitler Land, Abortion Land, and Satan Land, oops almost forgot, everyones favorite: Socialist Land. Could it be that you don't have good ideas or solutions to offer? If you have some good ideas to fix this mess I would love to hear them. But going to all the "Lands" with you has gotten tiresome. After the 06 and 08 elections your side (Republicans) has been reduced to a mostly southern, almost all white party with no Ideas or Solutions. All you have left is ubstruction and opposition to anything and everything this President wants, and was elected to do, which consists mostly of cleaning up your party's messes. Seems odd to me that your side was responsible making the mess, but wants to gripe about how the other side tries to fix it. Your right cheez, you should "Hide and Watch" Democrats fix it. We did it in the 90's with Bill and we can do it agian. I remember the same sort of discussions back then as well, nothing has really changed at all. Same ole stuff. Using the Constitution for toilet paper........., All the "Lands" blah blah blah.

 

[Guest]

finbully - 9/6/2009 7:17 PM

R14 - 9/6/2009 8:03 AM
Basically baby boomers are using all the funds up, while new workers have to foot the ever increasing bills.

Sounds like the government is in the Ponzi scheme business to me.

Ponzi's make people like Madoff money. emoScratch

Govt has not made money of medicare, instead it is a revenue drain (ie adds to the deficit). Try blaming unfunded mandates. emoApplause

 

[crod]

Obama sux. Thats all I have to say about the whole thing. If he knocked on my door, I would tell him to get off my porch.

 

[Guest]

Danny I have never once said that we do not have a healthcare problem that does not need to be fixed. I have no idea of how to do this properly. I am not the one who was elected and is getting paid to do it. I will say that if or when someone comes up with a plan that is not totally controled by the government I will support it.
I go to all these "lands" as you call them because that is all your side has going for them. As far as your side cleaning up anything in the 90's well that is a real joke. Clinton and his cronies are more responsible for the mess we are in right now than Bush is for sure. Bush just added to the mess with the war spending. It was going to happen anyway because of the bleeding heart liberals forcing Fannie and Freddie as well as others to make loans to people who could not pay them back. All in the name of fairness. All that Clinton accomplished when he was in office was to bring shame to the office like no one before or since. Sure the economy did well under Clinton but neither you nor anyone else can point to any policy of his administration that caused the upturn. He was simply at the right place at the right time.
You have yet to answer a number of questions presented to you by me and some others about this healthcare situation. I will repond to your Youtube links. Yes it is a shame how insurance companies are raping the American people. It is doubtful that anyone will deny this fact. However, forcing socialized medicine upon ALL of the people in this country and asking the working people to bear the cost is in no way the answer. Go after these insurance rips and leave the working people out of it as far as paying.
Now you and others have repeatedly made statements that are outright lies about the Republicans not having a plan to fix the healthcare situation. They have come up with several variations of plans but all were shot down by the liberals whose only true goal is control.

 

[crod]

Obama couldnt fix a glass of tea. LOL

 

[Guest]

crod - 9/6/2009 11:26 PM

Obama couldnt fix a glass of tea. LOL

Exactly! And when he falls flat on his face he and his supporters will still be crying "Bush did it" emoBawl emoBawl

It was all Bush's fault. WAAAAAAAA emoBawl

 

[crod]

LOL. Yep. You are correct. I will say this, starting with the elderly...... if Obama somehow gets what he wants. You will be the first to suffer and as the rest of us age, so will we. I heard on the radio he wants Americans to save money. He is going to try and pass a bill that will give every American who puts one thousand dollars in a savings account, a matching thousand in their savings account. Some people are actually excited about it. Listen folks. That money wont be worth the paper it is printed on. IT IS BORROWED MONEY. You, the tax payer will have to pay back the very money he is giving you in higher taxes. Which brings up another point. If you, the middle class, think your taxes wont go up as he is promising........ Come on. Dont fool yourself.

 

[Guest]

Where are all of these plans that the republicans have come up with? I read CNN and google news, watch the tv news and I haven't heard the first peep from any republican coming up with a health care plan and they won't. All they want to do is whine about Obama's dog or Obama's vacation, or Obama's proposed speech to the school children.Put this huge list that you talk about on here for all of us to see. The republicans have never done anything for anyone except the rich ones, big oil, Haliburton, the big banks, etc. You can't shoot a plan down if there aren't any, the republicans won't even try to come up with anything, if they did, it would be a shock to the world, some news service would carry it. I could have missed something on Fox news since I don't watch it or maybe listen to that dope head Rush "Windbag" Limbaugh. He is even keeping quite for some reason.

 

[crod]

Bammapelosi sux

 

[Guest]

Doc1 - 9/6/2009 11:47 PM

Where are all of these plans that the republicans have come up with? I read CNN and google news, watch the tv news and I haven't heard the first peep from any republican coming up with a health care plan and they won't. All they want to do is whine about Obama's dog or Obama's vacation, or Obama's proposed speech to the school children. Put this huge list that you talk about on here for all of us to see. The republicans have never done anything for anyone except the rich ones, big oil, Haliburton, the big banks, etc. You can't shoot a plan down if there aren't any, the republicans won't even try to come up with anything, if they did, it would be a shock to the world, some news service would carry it. I could have missed something on Fox news since I don't watch it or maybe listen to that dope head Rush "Windbag" Limbaugh. He is even keeping quite for some reason.

Here is one plan Doc. It is doubtful you will read it so I will not bother with any more right now. You wil Not see this on the Communist News Network for a reason. They put your messiah in office and they are on his side.

http://www.gop.com/News/NewsRead.aspx?Guid=bc1d50c0-5ef7-4026-8db5-efd402b01677

The Republicans are not about "doing" for anybody. You are right about that. Just like the founding fathers who started this country. Government is not here to "DO" for people. That is the whole problem all wrapped up in a neat package. All the democtats are about is "DOING" for people and making others pay for it. Problem is that people have really caught on to the concept and are expecting the government to "DO" for them and are not willing to "DO" for themselves. We are in debt so deep now from all this democrat "DOING" that we will likely never pay it back. Mybe our grandchildren or great grandchildren will be able to pay the money back but that is highly unlikely because they too will expect the government to "DO" for them as well.
The conservatives are willing to let the country run as it will with minimal interferance from government. Now Bush was pretty much a RINO. He did have many good points but he became more and more liberal as time went on. That was his downfall. If he had stuck to the Republican platform and just let the country run itself then we would be much better off.
No country has EVER survived by"DOING" for the masses. That is called communism whether you like the term or not it is a fact. Communism has been proven to NOT work wherever it has been tried. The problem is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money. That is where we are right now.

 

[outcaster]

Cheez's own words really ring true "I have no idea of how to do this properly. I am not the one who was elected and is getting paid to do it". That is the main reason your side is not getting paid to do it anymore. After all they had 8 years, 6 of those years with a majority in both houses of Congress with virtually nothing accomplished for the average working American. Make no mistake, thats why your side lost last Nov. ,and no longer have the privilege of directing our country. That right folks! No Ideas, No Plans, but all they have is Abortion Land, Socialist Land, Satan Land,and Hitler Land to try to divert us to. In this case I guess its okay for you to "be part of the problem" if you can't be "part of the solution" Either way, we really don't need your Ideas (even if you had some).

 

[Hagen]

Higher taxes in a recession doesnt sound like a good plan for this average working American. How is this going to be funded? Make no mistake, its the first of many campain promises that will be broken. Its not gonna be the first lie that is intended to get you to give up some of your freedom in the name of change. Kick the lobbyist out of DC tort reform in medical malpractice. Line item veto and get out of our wallets and watch how this free market economy can run. The left is just as good at spinning what the right has done for 8yrs. A compromise and bipartizan solution is the only way to avoid a revolution of one side or the other. We have to work together and get government ruduced to allow the free market to work and to reduce the tax burden on the middle class. Im all for a hand to help folks up with but a handout not so much.

 

[outcaster]

Doc1 - 9/6/2009 11:47 PM

Where are all of these plans that the republicans have come up with? I read CNN and google news, watch the tv news and I haven't heard the first peep from any republican coming up with a health care plan and they won't. All they want to do is whine about Obama's dog or Obama's vacation, or Obama's proposed speech to the school children. Put this huge list that you talk about on here for all of us to see. The republicans have never done anything for anyone except the rich ones, big oil, Haliburton, the big banks, etc. You can't shoot a plan down if there aren't any, the republicans won't even try to come up with anything, if they did, it would be a shock to the world, some news service would carry it. I could have missed something on Fox news since I don't watch it or maybe listen to that dope head Rush "Windbag" Limbaugh. He is even keeping quite for some reason.

You're right Doc! Most Republicans are perfectly fine with things the way they are. So if you lose a job, change jobs, are self employed, work for a company that does not provide coverage, have a family history, pre-exsisting condidtion, or are not "profitable" enough to cover, you are SOL in thier view. Some have even suggested on here that if you fall into any of those categories, that somehow you are lazy, not responsible, and "Stealing my hard earned money"

 

[Hagen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO2eh6f5Go0 kinda hokey but i like it.