Bubbakat
Well-known member
I have got to agree with you on this. They have forgotten that it is we the people not we the politican.
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I have got to agree with you on this. They have forgotten that it is we the people not we the politican.
G
Guest
Guest
</p>
Getting defensive proves what? I am a democrat, not a fence stradler, you are for one or the other, when you register to vote you have to choose. You or any of the others still haven't given me this list of republican acomplishments, you can go back as many years as you want to. I am not getting my panties in a wad, just stating that Obama is trying to pull this country out of a huge hole without any republican help. When he goes down, we all go down, there won't be two lines at the soup kitchens or unemployment lines, there will b one. Doing something is better than nothing.</p>
Sniperchoke
Well-known member
On the contrary doing nothing might be better if you look at both parties history.
SpurHunter
Well-known member
"Doing something is better than nothing?"
Ok, call me confused then.
Bush sends us to Iraq, WITH the blessing of several prominent democrats I might add, and multiple OTHER countries, ALL believing there was massive qty's of WMD's. All this shortly after we had just learned a very painful lesson on 9-11, which was: If you let a sleeping dog lie, even when he occasionally wakes up and "ONLY" barks at the moon, eventually he will wake up and bite your keister!
There was attack after attack on our own soil, and our interests around the world under the 8 years of Mr. Lewinski. He did nothing.....and so we all paid the price, over 3000 paid the ultimate.
Bush made his decisions based on your exact statement Doc, but he is now blamed for every problem in this country, and the claims are made that ONLY Obama and the Democrats can fix it. I am not sure if ANY party can fix it.....
I am just sick and tired of the double standard. I have seen conservative after conservative mention things Bush or another conservative did that they didnt like.
Yet Obama's massive failures, gaffs, and mis-cues on so many things are blaring, yet nary a single liberal will never be heard admitting any of these things. Its like when a small child does something bad, and their parents are standing there looking at magic marker scribbled on the wall, and the child stares away saying..."it wasnt me", "I didnt do it", its as if they dont acknowledge it, it didn’t happen??!!
I will go back in my hole now, and pretend its all going to be all right.....
Ok, call me confused then.
Bush sends us to Iraq, WITH the blessing of several prominent democrats I might add, and multiple OTHER countries, ALL believing there was massive qty's of WMD's. All this shortly after we had just learned a very painful lesson on 9-11, which was: If you let a sleeping dog lie, even when he occasionally wakes up and "ONLY" barks at the moon, eventually he will wake up and bite your keister!
There was attack after attack on our own soil, and our interests around the world under the 8 years of Mr. Lewinski. He did nothing.....and so we all paid the price, over 3000 paid the ultimate.
Bush made his decisions based on your exact statement Doc, but he is now blamed for every problem in this country, and the claims are made that ONLY Obama and the Democrats can fix it. I am not sure if ANY party can fix it.....
I am just sick and tired of the double standard. I have seen conservative after conservative mention things Bush or another conservative did that they didnt like.
Yet Obama's massive failures, gaffs, and mis-cues on so many things are blaring, yet nary a single liberal will never be heard admitting any of these things. Its like when a small child does something bad, and their parents are standing there looking at magic marker scribbled on the wall, and the child stares away saying..."it wasnt me", "I didnt do it", its as if they dont acknowledge it, it didn’t happen??!!
I will go back in my hole now, and pretend its all going to be all right.....
beetlespin
Well-known member
It will be ok next year when we get rid of this unbalanced house and senate we have
AThornton
Well-known member
No Doc, you are wrong. Hate to tell you, but you DON'T have to be for one or the other. I will not be told what I do or do not have to do, or what I do or do not have to believe. I agree with some views that Dems have, I agree with some views that Repubs have. I am completely free to believe whatever I want to believe. Having said that, I do NOT believe Obama was the right man for the job, I do NOT believe he was qualified to be a president, I do NOT believe he is associated with the kinds of people that will be beneficial to the survival of the USA, I do NOT believe he is pulling America out of a huge hole, I do NOT believe he is pulling America out of a depression, I do NOT believe that he can effectively run this country, and I do NOT believe that my children and grandchildren will be in a better situation in the future because of him. There's just a short list of what I don't believe. And before you pull the racist card.....I'm against the PLAN, not the MAN. I think the majority of his claims have been nothing short of complete BS.
And you want me to tell you the achievements of the Republicans.......why? I asked a simple question of whether or not you guys approve of him or not. He is a year into his presidency. Nothing has gotten better in my mind. Nothing as changed. My small business is still hanging on by a mere thread. Government associated work is still being outsourced for cheaper prices instead of staying local and helping locals. My future still looks incredibly dim as far as my business and my finances look. None of which is anything of my own fault. But hey, let's give a bunch of money to folks that are already filthy rich. Let's buy into these huge corporations so they don't fail. What about the 65 hard-working folks I've had to lay off over the last year, family members included? What about the insurance that none of my family or employees have anymore because it is unaffordable? What about the unemployment that this country is experiencing? What about the tent cities that are all over every single town because folks are out of work and living off of missions?
G
Guest
Guest
Spur, make a list of all of Obama's failures, I don't remember any so far. I know he said during the election he was trying to get a lot of things done but trying to do them is not a failure, it hasn't happened yet. If our house and senate worked together, a lot of problems would get solved but we both know the republicans will not help at all, they have been invided to help by Obama but they still do nothing but whine and gripe. As i have said before, the republicans want him to fail in anything he trys or wants to try. The health care bill is another thing he is trying to get done in this country but the democrats are having to do it alone, this bill would help everyone in the USA, not just democrats. Both sides agree it needs to happen but you have only one side trying to get it done.
Sniperchoke
Well-known member
As a citizen I don't want a lot of yes men in the gov't. Obama has no excuses he should be able to pass anything he wants because he has a super majority and can run anything through.
SpurHunter
Well-known member
</p>
Now I know your joking....Good one Gary, you almost had me going there. </p>
Buoy-Master
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2006
- Messages
- 10,855
Spur. I demand you fix your signature for free...Right Now!
beetlespin
Well-known member
The republicans don't have the opportunity to work on the healthcare bill. The democrats have enough votes to do whatever they want. They don't need or want help from the republicans. I just hope this healthcare bill gets nixed by the next president before it actually takes affect.
G
Guest
Guest
Bettle, that is as good of an excuse as any, they have been invited to help but they are the party of "NO". They won't help but they will hinder as much as possible. In other words you are saying that everyone in the USA doesn't need healthcare, you may not need it but there are millions more who do.
Your right...I'm right. The $39...equals the citizens. NOT all citizens PAY taxes as we well know. The $111 are us that take up the slack for the "slackers" you might say....us the TAXPAYERS!
Let me think what I want to give up....so that a deadbeat...can have insurance. Uh...NOTHING. That didn't take long! LMAO
Let me think what I want to give up....so that a deadbeat...can have insurance. Uh...NOTHING. That didn't take long! LMAO
outcaster
Well-known member
I agree Doc1 sooner or later you have to pick a side to be on. I'm a Democrat/Liberal for several reasons. But primarily for one reason: In my view the Republicans/Conservatives have been on the "wrong side of history" dating back almost a hundred years when it has come to the big issues and progress of our nation in the 20th century. Almost ALL of the good ideas/decisions made over the last 75 years have been progressive ideas, and bitterly opposed by Republicans/Conservatives. I really have a problem with a political party that has opposed: Civil Rights, Womens Rights, Racial Integration, Social Security, Medicare, clean water and air acts, child labor laws, minimum wage (creation and increases), 40 hr work week, OSHA standards, unemployment insurance, workers comp., the G.I. Bill, and most recently health care reform and gay/lesbian rights. Now, just like the past, the conservatives are the Party of "NO". Democrats have not gotten it right every time, and every progressive idea is not a good one. Some conservatives will still argue that the above listed items were not good ideas at all. It seems that each time democrats get into power the President has to clean up a pretty big mess. So I'm going to give our President some time to get things turned around. This economy mess wasn't created in 11 months and won't be fixed in 11 months. But I believe things are starting to turn for the better, and 2010 will end better than it started, just like 2009 did, because I do believe history tells me that progressive ideas are better than conservative ones. (If there are any) besides more Tax Cuts for the wealthy.
AThornton
Well-known member
2010 will end better than 2009 just by a simple law of averages. Things have been in the toilet for 2 years now, and statistically they shouldn't last too much longer. Problem with that is, Obama will be the one credited for the comeback, when in all reality he will have not done much, if anything, to actually spark the turnaround. Kind of like that Nobel Prize....
Sniperchoke
Well-known member
Repubs been on the wrong side of history Lincoln = republican that abolished slavery. Reagan = Defeated Communist Russia. GW Bush = Freed Iraq + Eliminated Sadam. As for the Dems Senator Byrd = former KKK leader. David Duke= former KKK Wallace = Racist Segregationist. Kerry = lied about former fellow soldiers and war crimes. Clinton = Monica, Pelosi = just plain scary crazy, Carter = total screw up and anti-Semite, Sen Kennedy = murdering alcoholic. Both sides have had bad eggs but to say Repubs are the only ones on the wrong side of history is a joke.
Buoy-Master
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2006
- Messages
- 10,855
All I can say is atleast Bill Clinton never inhailed................................................................... As for his afair with Monica, who could blame him! LOL! I liked Ol Bill.
As for his afair with Monica, who could blame him! LOL! I liked Ol Bill.outcaster
Well-known member
No, It's not a joke as evidenced by your long long list of Republican/Conservative accomplishments over the last 100 years. Winning an arms race and attacking Iraq, that's it? Now that's a Joke! Yes we do have some bad eggs and people I wish would just shut up. But I do believe, and history supports me, that at every important point on social and economic issues over the last 75-100 years and especially in my lifetime Conservatives have stood in the way and said "no". Yes, a Republican, Lincoln ended slavery and lost his life as result. But by the late 19th century and the beginning of the 20th the two political parties switched ideology. The Republicans taking the side of, and looking out for business and industry, while Democrats took the side of the working class and the poor. That still mostly remains true today. I'll give you Reagan/Bush1 defeating Communism. However, they did accomplish this with much support from Democrats and had some help along the way from such liberals as Truman and Kennedy. Recently, many/most Democrats ignored that little voice inside them and even gave W a pass in the beginning while he was beating the war drum for Iraq. How much blood and money is one crazy dictator worth? Only Exxon/Mobile knows the answer to that. David Duke? Really? He was a REPUBLICAN State Legislator from LA. Wallace was rejected and shamed by democrats/liberals when he stood in the University doorway. He later ran for President, and changed political parties and was nominated by The American Party (a fiscal and social right wing party). As for Byrd, he was a KKK member for 2 years in the 1940's, and over time has changed his thinking. Just goes to show how backward the state of WVA is to keep re-electing him. You like to throw out names of Democrats/Liberal you're not fond of: Lets give it a try: Warren Harding, Calvin Coolidge, Herbert Hoover (ever heard of Hooverville?), Gerald Ford, Bush 1 Bush 2, Palin, and everyones favorite: Tricky Dick Nixon. So if you like: clean water and air, paid vacation, safe working conditions, never been lynched or had your church firebombed, believe that all Americans regardless of sex or race, or religion should have the same opportunities, drink a beer without being thrown in jail, used Medicare, Social Security, if your children go to high school instead of working in the coal mines. Be sure to thank one of those pinko, commie, tree hugging, girley-man, crybaby, Godless un-American Liberals.
Sniperchoke
Well-known member
Outcaster you need to be educated a little read and then comment.
Politics and Blacks
President Barack Obama won an unprecedented 96 percent of the black vote. That's not much of a news story since blacks typically give their votes to the Democratic candidate. Blacks are probably the most politically loyal people in the nation and it is almost taken as gospel, at least among civil rights organizations and black and white liberals, that the only way black people can make socioeconomic progress is through the politics of race and special government programs. However, such a vision can be subjected to empirical evidence.
In 1940, when blacks were politically impotent, their poverty rate was 87 percent. By 1960, before blacks achieved much political power, it fell to 47 percent. During that interval, in various skilled trades, the incomes of blacks relative to whites more than doubled. Before 1960, there were no anti-poverty programs or affirmative action programs that can explain an economic advance that exceeded any other 20-year interval, though there were Truman and Eisenhower administration attacks on some of the gross forms of racial discrimination. A significant chunk of black progress occurred simply through migration from rural areas in the South to big Northern cities. Between 1960 and 1980, black poverty fell roughly 17 percent and continued falling to today's 24 percent. The decline in black poverty between 1960 and 1980 might have simply been a continuation of a trend starting much earlier and cannot be attributed solely to the 1964 Civil Rights Act, President Johnson's War on Poverty, or Richard Nixon's affirmative action.
Most of the major problems that many black people face are not amendable to political solutions and government anti-poverty programs. Let's look at some. In 1940, 86 percent of black children were born inside marriage, and the illegitimacy rate among blacks was about 15 percent. Today, only 35 percent of black children are born inside marriage, and the illegitimacy rate hovers around 70 percent. Today's breakdown of the black family is unprecedented. It began in the 1960s with the War on Poverty and the harebrained ideas of the welfare state. In the mid-1960s, Daniel Moynihan sounded the alarm about the breakdown in the black family in his book "The Negro Family: The Case for National Action." At that time black illegitimacy was 26 percent. Moynihan said, "(A)t the heart of the deterioration of the fabric of the Negro society is the deterioration of the Negro family." He added, "The steady expansion of welfare programs can be taken as a measure of the steady disintegration of the Negro family structure over the past generation in the United States." Moynihan's observations were greeted with charges of racism and blaming the victim. By the way, the welfare state is an equal opportunity family destroyer. Today's illegitimacy rate among whites, at nearly 30 percent, is higher than it was among blacks in the 1960s when Moynihan sounded the alarm. In Sweden, the mother of the welfare state, illegitimacy is 54 percent.
Blacks hold high offices and dominate the political arena in Philadelphia, Detroit, Baltimore, Washington, D.C., New Orleans and other cities. Yet these are the very cities with the nation's most rotten schools, highest crime rates, high illegitimacy rates, weak family structure and other forms of social pathology. I am not saying that blacks having political power is the cause of these problems. What I am saying is that the solution to most of the major problems that confront many black people won't be found in the political arena and by electing more blacks to high office. In fact, politicians tend to be hostile to some of the solutions to problems many blacks face such as school choice as a means to strengthen education, the elimination of oppressive licensing restrictions for various occupations, and supportive of job-destroying labor legislation such as minimum wage laws.
The bottom line is there is very little evidence anywhere on the planet that political power is a necessary condition for economic power.
Walter E. Williams is a professor of economics at George Mason University
Politics and Blacks
President Barack Obama won an unprecedented 96 percent of the black vote. That's not much of a news story since blacks typically give their votes to the Democratic candidate. Blacks are probably the most politically loyal people in the nation and it is almost taken as gospel, at least among civil rights organizations and black and white liberals, that the only way black people can make socioeconomic progress is through the politics of race and special government programs. However, such a vision can be subjected to empirical evidence.
In 1940, when blacks were politically impotent, their poverty rate was 87 percent. By 1960, before blacks achieved much political power, it fell to 47 percent. During that interval, in various skilled trades, the incomes of blacks relative to whites more than doubled. Before 1960, there were no anti-poverty programs or affirmative action programs that can explain an economic advance that exceeded any other 20-year interval, though there were Truman and Eisenhower administration attacks on some of the gross forms of racial discrimination. A significant chunk of black progress occurred simply through migration from rural areas in the South to big Northern cities. Between 1960 and 1980, black poverty fell roughly 17 percent and continued falling to today's 24 percent. The decline in black poverty between 1960 and 1980 might have simply been a continuation of a trend starting much earlier and cannot be attributed solely to the 1964 Civil Rights Act, President Johnson's War on Poverty, or Richard Nixon's affirmative action.
Most of the major problems that many black people face are not amendable to political solutions and government anti-poverty programs. Let's look at some. In 1940, 86 percent of black children were born inside marriage, and the illegitimacy rate among blacks was about 15 percent. Today, only 35 percent of black children are born inside marriage, and the illegitimacy rate hovers around 70 percent. Today's breakdown of the black family is unprecedented. It began in the 1960s with the War on Poverty and the harebrained ideas of the welfare state. In the mid-1960s, Daniel Moynihan sounded the alarm about the breakdown in the black family in his book "The Negro Family: The Case for National Action." At that time black illegitimacy was 26 percent. Moynihan said, "(A)t the heart of the deterioration of the fabric of the Negro society is the deterioration of the Negro family." He added, "The steady expansion of welfare programs can be taken as a measure of the steady disintegration of the Negro family structure over the past generation in the United States." Moynihan's observations were greeted with charges of racism and blaming the victim. By the way, the welfare state is an equal opportunity family destroyer. Today's illegitimacy rate among whites, at nearly 30 percent, is higher than it was among blacks in the 1960s when Moynihan sounded the alarm. In Sweden, the mother of the welfare state, illegitimacy is 54 percent.
Blacks hold high offices and dominate the political arena in Philadelphia, Detroit, Baltimore, Washington, D.C., New Orleans and other cities. Yet these are the very cities with the nation's most rotten schools, highest crime rates, high illegitimacy rates, weak family structure and other forms of social pathology. I am not saying that blacks having political power is the cause of these problems. What I am saying is that the solution to most of the major problems that confront many black people won't be found in the political arena and by electing more blacks to high office. In fact, politicians tend to be hostile to some of the solutions to problems many blacks face such as school choice as a means to strengthen education, the elimination of oppressive licensing restrictions for various occupations, and supportive of job-destroying labor legislation such as minimum wage laws.
The bottom line is there is very little evidence anywhere on the planet that political power is a necessary condition for economic power.
Walter E. Williams is a professor of economics at George Mason University
outcaster
Well-known member
You're a good at copy/paste. I'm impressed. I don't need someone to re-write history for me and paste it. I'm quite capable and educated enough to form opinions of my own. What was that article about anyway? African/American Social Economics? I thought we were talking about Great Republican Ideas in the 20th century... Oh! Oh! I've got one... Lets give more tax cuts to the wealthy that'll work! As far a race is concerned: If Republicans/conservatives would have had things go their way in the 40's 50's and 60's we would have had following decades of two water fountains, giving bus seats to a white person, eating behind the restaurant instead of inside. separate schools, hotels, an all white military and no voting. Perhaps it's you that needs to be educated, go back and look at how conservatives/liberals voted on those issues. That is certainly not to say that anyone who considers themselves a republican/conservative is a racist today, although many are out there, not as loud, but still there none the less. Time goes forward. And most conservatives now acknowledge racial integration to be positive for our society. The more things change, the more they stay the same. Even today, just like the past the Republicans are the party of "NO" A liberal sees pain and tries to heal it. Sees war and tries to stop it. Sees injustice and tries to correct it. A liberal believes that unless you can help with the solution to a problem you are a part of the problem. Saying "No" can be a good thing. But saying "No" without offering a good alternative solution doesn't help either. If you don't want to help get our nation back on track, fine. Just stay out of the way of those that are trying. Especially when they are cleaning up a mess caused mostly by your side. Being Liberal is much more fun too!
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